If the KCLUG is looking for a place to move it's meeting to my boss has mentioned several times about the possibility of having the KCLUG meeting in our conference room. I know I don't go to the meetings (like once I went) but, we have a large conference room that would hold at least 40 people. It has a big screen plasma TV for connecting to a laptop, WIFI access as well as a complete demo center with Blades running VMWare that we could do fun things with (since I am in charge of the demo center). I also have a large cell-based HP server, a SAN and fiber fabric in our demo center that we could play around with. Our office is right off the Cambridge Circle exit on I-35 near downtown with tons of parking right at the front door and plenty of places to go after the meeting down the hill on SW Blvd. If the KCLUG is serious about changing where they hold the meetings let me know and I will make the conference room available whenever you want it. Currently in our demo center we are running everything from HP-UX, RHEL, W2K3 and VMWare. We could do a lot with the toys in my sandbox here. Phil ________________________________ From: kclug-bounces@kclug.org [mailto:kclug-bounces@kclug.org] On Behalf Of Billy Crook Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 7:52 AM To: Kelsay, Brian - Kansas City, MO Cc: KCLUG (E-mail) Subject: Re: New Meeting Location? ...insert KCLug Microsoft Server joke.... Well, he sent it before the meeting, but hadn't synchronized his Outlook with the KCLug Exchange server until just now. On Nov 9, 2007 7:40 AM, Kelsay, Brian - Kansas City, MO < brian.kelsay@kcc.usda.gov> wrote: It would have been nice if the message made it before the meeting. Slow mail server? -----Original Message----- From: Jim Herrmann Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 7:16 PM To: kclug Subject: New Meeting Location? I am sitting at Paul & Jacks in North Kansas City. They now have Wi-fi! I tested it and got 5M down and 500K up, so it's a very good connection. They have food and drinks including beer! They are open until at least 10:00 p.m., but are willing to stay open longer if we have enough people. They also have a back room that will seat at least 16 people at the table. I'm thinking we should consider moving our meeting here. It's a nice place with a fast internet connection, and did I mention that they serve beer! Not to mention the killer tenderloin and awesome chili. We can discuss at tomorrow's meeting. Peace, Jim _______________________________________________ Kclug mailing list Kclug@kclug.org http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug

Yes, beer is allowed, but not to excess. And as long as it stays controlled. There is a fridge and kitchen area. We would have to make sure we clean up and all that after we are done.

-----Original Message----- From: Kyle Sexton [mailto:ks@mocker.org] Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 10:48 AM To: Phil Thayer Cc: KCLUG (E-mail) Subject: Re: New Meeting Location?

"Phil Thayer" <phil.thayer@vitalsite.com> writes:

...

If the KCLUG is looking for a place to move it's meeting to my boss has mentioned several times about the possibility of having the KCLUG meeting in our conference room. I know I don't go to the meetings (like once I went) but, we have a large conference room that would hold at least 40 people. It has a big screen plasma TV for connecting to a laptop, WIFI access as well as a complete demo center with Blades running VMWare that we could do fun things with (since I am in charge of the demo center). I also have a large cell-based HP server, a SAN and fiber fabric in our demo center that we could play around with. Our office is right off the Cambridge Circle exit on I-35 near downtown with tons of parking right at the front door and plenty of places to go after the meeting down the hill on SW Blvd. If the KCLUG is serious about changing where they hold the meetings let me know and I will make the conference room available whenever you want it.

Currently in our demo center we are running everything from HP-UX, RHEL, W2K3 and VMWare. We could do a lot with the toys in my sandbox here.

Phil

But can there be beer? :)

-- Kyle Sexton

On Nov 9, 2007 10:02 AM, Phil Thayer <phil.thayer@vitalsite.com> wrote:

If the KCLUG is looking for a place to move it's meeting to my boss has mentioned several times about the possibility of having the KCLUG meeting in our conference room. I know I don't go to the meetings (like once I went) but, we have a large conference room that would hold at least 40 people. It has a big screen plasma TV for connecting to a laptop, WIFI access as well as a complete demo center with Blades running VMWare that we could do fun things with (since I am in charge of the demo center). I also have a large cell-based HP server, a SAN and fiber fabric in our demo center that we could play around with. Our office is right off the Cambridge Circle exit on I-35 near downtown with tons of parking right at the front door and plenty of places to go after the meeting down the hill on SW Blvd. If the KCLUG is serious about changing where they hold the meetings let me know and I will make the conference room available whenever you want it.

Currently in our demo center we are running everything from HP-UX, RHEL, W2K3 and VMWare. We could do a lot with the toys in my sandbox here.

Wow this place sounds a lot better than the library. I would second it.

While we all consider the operational details the one being overlooked is neutrality. That's to say the venue being neutral. By inherent concept I would expect a public library to be public. And any other location is that much less public. Think this over carefully and choose wisely.

A public space (open to the public)

Not Public but pretty darn close to it.

An elevator, if on a floor other than the 1st

No need for that. We are only a single floor.

Open 'ail 1AM

I have a Key so it's open til whenever...

T1+

Yup.. Got it covered.

Public Wifi

Yup...Got it covered. You could drive up here anytime you want and park in front of our office and use it.

Is clean

Yup...Got it covered there too.

Has a projector or large screen

Widescreen plasma TV.

seats 25 + equipment

At least 40 with servers and SAN to demo.

free parking

Yup. Plenty of parking within steps of the door.

Located right off a major highway

I-35 is within throwing distance.

Located equally inconvenient to everyone (as Hal has said)

Very centrally located.

I like meeting in a public location. Meeting in a place of business seems to have a few problems. If it's a tech business, you usually need a person to vouch for the group, and any random person that decides to visit. I don't want the group to get a bad name because someone did something bad while we were there.

I trust that people coming to the meeting are not going to be hooligans and tear up the place.

Not in a long time. :(

-----Original Message----- From: kclug-bounces@kclug.org [mailto:kclug-bounces@kclug.org] On Behalf Of Christopher A. Bier Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 2:36 PM To: kclug@kclug.org Subject: RE: New Meeting Location?

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I like meeting in a public location. Meeting in a place of business seems to have a few problems. If it's a tech business, you usually need a person to vouch for the group, and any random person that decides to visit. I don't want the group to get a bad name because someone did something bad while we were there.

I trust that people coming to the meeting are not going to be hooligans and tear up the place.

Have you been to a meeting? :-)

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_______________________________________________ Kclug mailing list Kclug@kclug.org http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug

Ignoring the whole debate of where to go, can I ask that it be made sure that if it is decided to be held in a pub or bar or such, that it allows people under 18/21/otherarbitrarylegalage? I know I haven't attended a meeting yet, but it would suck to want to (or be able to..) go to one, but not being allowed in the front door.

On Friday 09 November 2007 23:02:52 Billy Crook wrote:

Yeah, that's a good point. You really don't want to shut out the youth.

Yeah, cause, right now the meetings are just CRAWLING with kids, aren't they? You people are fools. Someone offers you a great place to have the meetings, for free, with excellent facilities, and all you can do is come up with objections without even having seen the place. Oh dear, it's not commercially neutral. Nobody says every meeting from now on has to be there. If there are actually people who don't like it, whether they've seen it or not, they don't have to come.

More answers... I will make sure that if I am not able to attend somebody will be there to take care of the meeting. If I make a committment to do this then I will make sure it icovered when I am not there. As far as something getting broken then we will deal with that then. I doubt that we will have this problem. People under 18 are more than welcome in the office. I see no problem with that. Kool-aid is fine as long as you don't get too wild with it. You know how kids react to all that sugar. :) A rotating schedule wouldn't be such a bad idea if you wanted to. I have no problem with that. I just think that the idea of having a place to meet with easy parking, plenty of space and resources that could be used to expand our ability to try different things would be a good idea. To be perfectly honest with everybody my company and I are looking for ways to get more visibility in the KC marketplace. My boss and I both felt that this would be one of the ways to do this. We are not looking for a way to have HP Product demo's at the meetings, just a way for the technical people in town to know who we are. If someone knows us they might be likely to mention us when the company they work for is looking for some kind of hardware. I am not looking to change the structure of the meetings or what is done in the meetings. Just a way to make it easier for people to come to the meetings and better facilitation of those meetings. I will not have my feelings hurt if people don't want to use our facility. Phil ________________________________ From: kclug-bounces@kclug.org on behalf of Justin Dugger Sent: Sat 11/10/2007 10:56 PM To: Jonathan Hutchins Cc: kclug@kclug.org Subject: Re: New Meeting Location? On Nov 10, 2007 6:18 PM, Jonathan Hutchins <hutchins@tarcanfel.org> wrote:

On Friday 09 November 2007 23:02:52 Billy Crook wrote:

...

Yeah, that's a good point. You really don't want to shut out the youth.

Yeah, cause, right now the meetings are just CRAWLING with kids, aren't they?

I haven't been to a meeting either. But primarily because it sounded like the parking was a mess. You can't declare there isn't a problem with the meeting location to fix by polling people who went. They're already a self selected group.

You people are fools. Someone offers you a great place to have the meetings, for free, with excellent facilities, and all you can do is come up with objections without even having seen the place. Oh dear, it's not commercially neutral.

I also don't see the problem with that. If companies want to sponsor meetings, it sounds fine to me, as long as they're not turning the event into a promotional opportunity for their company. If the group is popular / valuable enough to warrant multiple competing bids, perhaps then one can talk about perceived neutrality and sponsorship processes. But for the moment the choice appears to be between a location that doesn't appreciate foreign hardware, doesn't stay open late enough, a restaurant that wants the group's business.

Nobody says every meeting from now on has to be there. If there are actually people who don't like it, whether they've seen it or not, they don't have to come.

To put that more constructively: perhaps a test run is in order? Maybe hold a meeting at each place and write down lessons learned. If people like these each of places enough perhaps a rotating schedule could work. Justin Dugger _______________________________________________ Kclug mailing list Kclug@kclug.org http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug

On Nov 10, 2007 6:18 PM, Jonathan Hutchins <hutchins@tarcanfel.org> wrote:

You people are fools. Someone offers you a great place to have the meetings, for free, with excellent facilities, and all you can do is come up with objections without even having seen the place. Oh dear, it's not commercially neutral.

It's not an objection to the specific site, it's a concern about possible problems that could come out of meeting at any commercial location (which you may recall is what we did while there was no downtown library). Any time a commercial entity hosts a meeting, there's reason to examine the potential ramifications One of the people who stopped by the booth at ITEC said he could probably hook us up to have our meetings at Cerner (where he works), but they'd have to work out some technical details for us to have broadband that was isolated from their corporate network for legal reasons (there's a five-letter acronym that starts with H, but I shan't spell it out as there are ladies on the list, and I'm trying to clean up my language). If we started having meetings there, someone in my company might say that I shouldn't be going, since they're considered a competitor, and it could have the appearance of some undefined impropriety. Meeting at the Public Library helps prevent that sort of thing. On Nov 11, 2007 7:36 AM, Phil Thayer <phil.thayer@vitalsite.com> wrote:

A rotating schedule wouldn't be such a bad idea if you wanted to.

There's a reason we always meet at the same place. If we decided to do something like have the First Wednesday meeting at the library, and the Third Tuesday meeting at your place, there would be a few people showing up at the other location. If we were to decide to move to a different location, I'd recommend we announce the effective date of the change (but not map the location until the change were effective; that could confuse people) well in advance on the website. I just handed out hundreds of cards telling people where we meet NOW, and I'd hate for them to be wrong. Perhaps if someone could quantify the number of people who aren't going to the Library that would go to the various alternatives being suggested, we'd have a better idea of how that would work out.

On Nov 11, 2007 9:10 AM, Phillip Batista <febaen@gmail.com> wrote:

Monty J. Harder wrote:

...

On Nov 11, 2007 7:36 AM, Phil Thayer <phil.thayer@vitalsite.com <mailto:phil.thayer@vitalsite.com>> wrote:

A rotating schedule wouldn't be such a bad idea if you wanted to.

There's a reason we always meet at the same place. If we decided to do something like have the First Wednesday meeting at the library, and the Third Tuesday meeting at your place, there would be a few people showing up at the other location.

. . .

Well the easiest way to get around that would be to just have extra meetings at the new place, and then gradually stop doing the old place as often.

It doesn't "get around" the fundamental problem that if there are two different meeting places, one of them is the wrong one at any given time. (This is awfully close to the original formulation of Murphy's Law, which is that if there are two ways to do something, someone will do it the wrong way.) I often wonder how many people show up at the Library on the first Tuesday, the third Wednesday, or even Tuesday the 14th (which is 13 days after Wednesday the 1st, but only the second Tuesday, illustrative of the exception to the 13-day rule). At least they're at the right place, though.

On Sun, 2007-11-11 at 09:03 -0600, Monty J. Harder wrote:

It's not an objection to the specific site, it's a concern about possible problems that could come out of meeting at any commercial location (which you may recall is what we did while there was no downtown library). Any time a commercial entity hosts a meeting, there's reason to examine the potential ramifications One of the people who stopped by the booth at ITEC said he could probably hook us up to have our meetings at Cerner (where he works), but they'd have to work out some technical details for us to have broadband that was isolated from their corporate network for legal reasons (there's a five-letter acronym that starts with H, but I shan't spell it out as there are ladies on the list, and I'm trying to clean up my language). If we started having meetings there, someone in my company might say that I shouldn't be going, since they're considered a competitor, and it could have the appearance of some undefined impropriety. Meeting at the Public Library helps prevent that sort of thing.

But meeting at the public library also keeps down attendance. Parking is awful, and with Sprint Center and the P&L district opening, it is only going to get worse. The problems with hardware have already been mentioned. Heck, I work downtown and live five minutes away from the library, and *I* hate dragging my carcass out there in the evening (which is why I don't go to meetings). I can't imagine how much groaning must ensue from folks who actually have to drive in from elsewhere (and fight traffic the whole way). As for the commercial neutrality thing. Technical organizations meet at vendor and/or customer locations all the time. It gets the vendor face time with potential customers, and it gets the organization a place to stay. Everybody is happy. I have yet to have an employer ask me to stay away from an organization because it meets at a competitor's location; in fact, if anyone would be concerned on that mark, it would be the vendor hosting the meeting, because now they're opening their facility to potential competitors and snoops. Furthermore, the KCLUG might increase membership and activity by taking a more friendly approach to vendors. In addition to great information on technical projects that are cool, they usually bring food and swag -- three of the four magical ingredients for attracting IT geeks to any function (the fourth -- skimpily-clad "show assistants," is probably asking too much of Heartland vendors, but I can always dream). Every day sees a new shop open its doors, either selling solutions that sit on open source or using it in their data centers. We could all learn a lot (and get full stomachs, too) by inviting them in to talk about what they do. Cambridge Drive is easy to access and centrally located right on a major interstate. It has the additional advantage of being relatively centrally located for the IT "hubs" in Johnson County and the Northland. +1 on moving to Cambridge. Matt Copple mcopple@kcopensource.org

This only happens during election periods...

I trust that people coming to the meeting are not going to be hooligans and tear up the place.

Where do I sign the petition? Sounds great to me. The library is high on the suck for brining in equipment to meetings. I wanted to bring in my modded Xbox running Linux but I didnt want to have to deal with the library in/out with the "weird" hardware. I presume your metting place wouldnt have issues with strange people bringing in strange hardware? I would make the suggestion that you offer a seperate (as in not connected nor available to your production network) "network" (different router IP, different IP segment) to serve the meetings WIFI and hardware connections. Later, Steven

would hold at least 40 people. It has a big screen plasma TV for connecting to a laptop, WIFI access as well as a complete demo center with Blades running VMWare that we could do fun things with (since I am in charge of the demo center). I also have a large cell-based HP server, a SAN and fiber fabric in our demo center that we could play around with. Our office is right off the Cambridge

On Nov 9, 2007 10:02 AM, Phil Thayer <phil.thayer@vitalsite.com> wrote:

If the KCLUG is looking for a place to move it's meeting to my boss has mentioned several times about the possibility of having the KCLUG meeting in our conference room. I know I don't go to the meetings (like once I went) but, we have a large conference room that would hold at least 40 people. It has a big screen plasma TV for connecting to a laptop, WIFI access as well as a complete demo center with Blades running VMWare that we could do fun things with (since I am in charge of the demo center). I also have a large cell-based HP server, a SAN and fiber fabric in our demo center that we could play around with. Our office is right off the Cambridge Circle exit on I-35 near downtown with tons of parking right at the front door and plenty of places to go after the meeting down the hill on SW Blvd. If the KCLUG is serious about changing where they hold the meetings let me know and I will make the conference room available whenever you want it.

Currently in our demo center we are running everything from HP-UX, RHEL, W2K3 and VMWare. We could do a lot with the toys in my sandbox here.

Something came to mind if we did switch, so what happens if you (Phil) are sick/out of town?

At some point the joke moves from something that is or isn't funny on its own to something that has momentum of its own and it is no longer a joke it is a shared piece of the fabric of the community oh sorry I've been reading Palahniuk On Nov 9, 2007 10:27 AM, Monty J. Harder <mjharder@gmail.com> wrote:

Those jokes are never funny. Not even once. Doing a variation on a joke that wasn't funny the first two times won't make it any better.

Windows Home Server 2003 maybe? On Nov 12, 2007 4:08 PM, Phillip Batista <febaen@gmail.com> wrote:

David Nicol wrote:

...

At some point the joke moves from something that is or isn't funny on its own to something that has momentum of its own and it is no longer a joke it is a shared piece of the fabric of the community

oh sorry I've been reading Palahniuk

On Nov 9, 2007 10:27 AM, Monty J. Harder <mjharder@gmail.com> wrote:

...

Those jokes are never funny. Not even once. Doing a variation on a joke that wasn't funny the first two times won't make it any better.

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So basically, memes?

What's next? "ohi, I upgraded ur server OS", "KCLUG, Microsoft Server, lol, etc", "I SWEAR IF I SEE THAT ****ING MICROSOFT SERVER ONE MORE TIME..."?

...Microsoft Server duckrolls? _______________________________________________ Kclug mailing list Kclug@kclug.org http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug