--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Luke -Jr <luke@dashjr.org> wrote:

The Cult of Liberty Most Rev. Donald J. Sanborn http://www.traditionalmass.org/articles/article.php?id=13&catname=7

From the above article:

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From these texts it is clear that the Catholic Church condemns freedom of conscience, freedom of religion, freedom of speech, and freedom of the press. Yet these "freedoms" are held as sacrosanct in the American culture. In an effort not to appear un-american, the Catholic clergy in the United States for the most part neglected these condemnations, as well as the teaching of Sacred Scripture, of the Church, and of the holy Fathers which supports them."

...

The very term toleration implies evil, and we are therefore not speaking about a right to profess [information condemned by Catholicism], since all right is founded in God. It is inconceivable that God would grant someone the right to be wrong

Which begs the question: how can Luke-Jr. support Free Software when two of its ideals, freedom of speech and freedom of the press, are so antithetical to Luke-Jr.'s version of Catholicism? If we believe the FSF's position that access to information should be free, regardless of the *content* of that information, we are apparently going against Traditional Catholicism's ideals in that regard. We are made heretics simply because we believe in free software and free information. Bear in mind that *all* Catholic writings presented in the following article occurred *after* the fourth and last Vatican II session in 1965, and therefore, according to Luke-Jr.'s position on the modern Catholic Church, originated from *heretical* Catholic doctrine and thought: Free Software's Surprising Sympathy With Catholic Doctrine http://www.linux.com/feature/49533

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The technological configuration underlying the Internet has a considerable bearing on its ethical aspects. Use of the new information technology and the Internet needs to be informed and guided by a resolute commitment to the practice of solidarity in the service of the common good. The Internet requires international cooperation in setting standards and establishing mechanisms to promote and protect [that common good]. Individuals, groups, and nations must have access to these new technologies. Cyberspace ought to be a resource of comprehensive information and services available without charge to all, and in a wide range of languages. The winner in this process will be humanity as a whole and not just a wealthy elite that controls science, technology, and the planet's resources. Determined action in the private and public sectors is needed to close and eventually eliminate the digital divide."

The above statements sound as if they could have been written by Richard M. Stallman, founder of the Free Software Foundation (FSF). In fact, they come from the Vatican Report "Ethics in Internet" (EiI, published in Vatican City, February 22, 2002). The FSF position on the same issues is that society "needs information that is truly available to its citizens -- for example, programs that people can read, fix, adapt, and improve, not just operate."

For the purposes of this article, we can regard software programs as a category of machinery. The 1967 Encyclical of Pope Paul VI on the development of peoples "Populorum Progressio" said, "Unless the existing machinery is modified, the disparity between rich and poor nations will increase rather than diminish."

Then in 1971, the Pastoral Instruction "Communio et Progressio" (CeP) on the means of social communication stated:

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With the right to be informed goes the duty to seek information. Information does not simply occur; it has to be sought. On the other hand, in order to get it, the man who wants information must have access to the varied means of social communication.

Consequently, the Catholic Church should not use proprietary file formats and computer protocols, since they can become a way to prevent access to information, restrict it or lock end users to any specific (maybe too expensive) software program.

This is very similar to Stallman's request to put an end to proprietary email attachments:

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This right to information is inseparable from freedom of communication.

When it comes to computer-based communication, this can be only guaranteed with Free formats and protocols. It also implies that computer users should be free to choose which programs to use for such communication. The same wish was expressed by Stallman:

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This freedom of communication also implies that individuals and groups must be free to seek out and spread information. It also means that they should have free access to the media....

An example of the cultural potential of the media can be found in their service to the traditional folk arts of countries where stories, plays, song and dance still express an ancient national inheritance. Because of their modern techniques, the media can make these achievements known more widely. They can record them so that they can be seen and heard again and again and make them accessible even in districts where the old traditions have vanished. In this way, the media help to impress on a nation a proper sense of its cultural identity and by expressing this, delight and enrich other cultures and countries as well.

Many developing countries are already successfully using free software and formats to preserve their cultural heritage since free software can be adapted quickly, at the smallest possible cost, to any language or dialect. Catholic missionaries worldwide should be informed that such tools exist.

--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Monty J. Harder <mjharder@gmail.com> wrote:

For the love of God, please, no more arguments on religion!

On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 6:24 PM, Leo Mauler <webgiant@yahoo.com> wrote:

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--- On Mon, 9/1/08, Luke -Jr <luke@dashjr.org> wrote:

...

The Cult of Liberty Most Rev. Donald J. Sanborn

Free Software's surprising sympathy with Catholic doctrine By Marco Fioretti on November 11, 2005

(Yes, I said it that way on purpose.)

I don't see it as an argument about religion, per se. A large organization thinks Linux should be wiped off the face of the Earth. When its Microsoft, people are happy to discuss their reasons. When its Traditional Catholicism, people shy away. Whats silly is that in *both situations* the problem isn't one of technology, its one of organizational philosophy. Why should one form of philosophy get special protection when another form merits discussion?

If I had not met the key players, I would think that we were reading conversations of bots that like inflammatory conversations. Come to think of it, that is not a bad idea... Anyone remember the Star Trek: NG episode where Lt. Cmdr. Data was working on his conversation skills? Brian Kelsay ________________________________ From: Jeffrey Watts Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2008 1:15 AM I see it as one troll feeding another troll. The result will be an infinite loop of hot air and flawed reasoning. Jeffrey. On Mon, Sep 1, 2008 at 7:40 PM, Leo Mauler <webgiant@yahoo.com> wrote I don't see it as an argument about religion, per se.